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Default 07-22-2007, 15:48

Hmmm... Haven't read it yet, can't be bothered to buy it and it'll be months before I can can borrow it, so all these spoilers are useful...

She killed Lupin?? Not impressed. At all. Frankly, I couldn't have cared less if Harry copped it. Still, at least Ron and Hermione made it out alive, and Dobby died (hooray!) I was right about Snape after all, but I didn't guess his motivation, such as it was. Poor old Severus.

I find something mildly disturbing about them having children. I know they're 18 by the end of the book, and well into adulthood in the epilogue, but I still think of them as children. Hey ho.
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Default 07-22-2007, 17:49

Hmm. I thihnk the epilogue could have been slightly more in-depth because the end was basically voldemorts dead *skip space of 19 years* everyone has children.

But I do hope that JK decides to continue writing. Afterall hogwarts is still standing and the main characters have children.
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Default 07-23-2007, 11:36

Overall I enjoyed the book, although the epilogue was unnecessary. I would have preferred for a few other loose ends to be tied up - like what happened to the Dursleys? Dudley finally grows up, then they get put into hiding for their own protection, we learn some backstory about Petunia, then nothing whatsoever.

The proper last few chapters were highly immersive. The unexpected location of Aberforth, the hiding but resilient students, Neville truly showing why he was picked to be in Gryffindor, the teachers finally mucking in to rid the school of evil and the Malfoys showing their true colours - fiercely loyal, to themselves.

In terms of the bits I didn't like, this was the main one:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hsing View Post
  • everybody was throwing around Forbidden Curses? A cruciatus for spitting at McGonnagall, when Harry couldn’t muster the scrouple-less-ness to put it on Bellatrix Lestarnge for killing (!) Sirius?
For me, it wasn't that he managed to get it working, it was the fact that Harry was prepared to attempt them so often. After all we've been taught about those three spells being the height of all evil, the way Harry uses them without a protest from even Hermione was very jarring. The real crux was when McGonagall used Imperio, I was in a state of shock - I simply can't believe that she would use them under any circumstance. I did think that there may be a more noble ending than "they kill all the bad guys", more along the lines of Dumbledore imprisoning Grindelwald, but I was wrong.

Another weird thing to add to Hsing's list was Hagrid. One moment he was completely covered in giant spiders, the next time we see him he's in the middle of the woods hung up by Death Eaters? I simply can't see why Voldemort would ask them to a) save Hagrid from the spiders (I can't believe he would survive the whole clan on his own), b) keep him alive, simply to carry Harry's body. Sure it made a nice symbol in the end, but considering Hagrid has been very resistant to them in the past it made no sense for them to keep him alive.

But anyway, the book as a whole was a good read and a fairly satisfying end. The Deathly Hallows were a nice addition to the HP mythology (though I'm sure no-one else was reminded of Thief of Time with the plantation of a not obviously relevant fairy-tale book...) and learning the Dumbledore history was a treat.

So when's the next one due out?


(Playing blind Pictionary, me drawing)
Ella: Is it a giraffe?
Me (stops drawing): No
Ella: Star Trek?
Me: Yes!
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Default 07-24-2007, 12:46

Read it, loved it. And that is not an accolade I readily hand out to a book. I most liked all the action, a far cry from OotP where there was barely any until the fighting near the end.

Of course, I knew there were always going to be things in DH I wasn't going to like. Most were loose ends not tied up. I felt more needed to be said at the end, instead of fast forwarding 19 years.

Some things which spring to mind, though I'm sure there are others:

- The Durseleys were never mentioned again after the start. There could have been a reconciliation scene where they see each other in a better light. Thids was hinted to at the start but never materialised.

- I always thought there was more to Cruikshanks than just an angry cat

- I didn't like how Voldemort kept missing Harry et al by moments

- That whole Hagrid still alive after being swept away by the spiders. Why would Voldemort want him alive?

- Snape knew now was the time to strike. Why stay in the lion's den? His work was done; he should have attacked Voldemort or Nagini, or else joined the others outside facing Deatheaters.

- The epilogue was crap, frankly. Naming the kids after parents, etc is so cliche & how everyone hooked up.

Overall I'm happy. Would have preferred it if they both died though...

Last edited by TheJackal; 07-24-2007 at 12:54.
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Default 07-25-2007, 23:50

I was a bit dissappointed. The writing got a bit Mills & Boon in parts.
Some of it was very far fetched even for magic. Hermione's little beaded bag, which held everything including the kitchen sink but she hid it in her sock at one point? Yet they have been lugging huge trunks on and off the Hogwarts Express for 7 years! From the other books we learnt that there are witches and wizards all over the world in vast numbers, just look at the turn out for the Quiditch world cup yet they bump into just the person they need or at least remember they saw/met/read about them somewhere.
Yes, I agree there were some loose ends I would have liked tied up - the Dursleys, the condition of Tonks son and who brought him up, did Lily ever know Snape loved her? Did George carry on with the joke shop without his twin?
There's a lot already mentioned above that I agree with too.
When they camped all those months, how did they wash, wash their clothes, get food besides wild mushrooms and never be seen by a living soul?
I'd also have liked to find out how muggle borns got into Hogwarts. Did they pay, were they scholar shipped. Does everyone go to Hogwarts in Britain or just the lucky ones. What happens to unschooled wizards and witches?
No, I'm still waiting for the end even though Voldemort is dead. (Still not sure why Harry isn't if he was a horcrux) I will have to read the near death experience bit with Dumbledore again.


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Default 07-26-2007, 01:01

Quote:
Originally Posted by AuntieM View Post
Hermione's little beaded bag, which held everything including the kitchen sink but she hid it in her sock at one point? Yet they have been lugging huge trunks on and off the Hogwarts Express for 7 years!
In my opinion, despite JKR's claims that she tends to read outside the fantasy genre and rarely interact with anything related to it, the little beaded bag screams Bag of Holding to me
(from D&D: Bag of holding - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). The lack of availability in that case is because they are rare and expensive items, meaning the magic creating them is high-level and complex.
One could assume the same for Hermione? After all, she's meant to be advanced beyond her years when it comes to magic.

Seems odd after all that trunk-hauling, but as prestigious as Hogwarts may be, the money required to give every student the equivalent of a Bag of Holding wouldn't realistically be available to them.


And as for the epilogue, I got the impression that the point that was being made was that everything in the lives of the characters had improved and there hadn't been any post-Voldemort troubles since he had been defeated 19 years ago. JKR was not giving us extensive details on the post-hogwarts lives of all her characters, but showing that all was well, giving us a little snapshot example of that. Cheesy as it was, her point was made with the very last line. "All was well."

Or it could just leave it all open for a whole new series of books ... just in case JKR gets bored some day a decade from now.
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Default 07-26-2007, 10:44

Yes, I too thought of Bag of Holding, and didn't have another famous witch figure have an item like this?
Although I seem to remember that all the luxurious stuff up to the bathroom (which explains the washing) are always included in a wizard's tent (see Quidditch worldcup scenes).
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Default 07-27-2007, 12:48

...Where did my post go?

*glares around*

I posted it last night/this morning. Actually posted it. And it's gone.


And I said to myself, 'I am glad that I am not a clockfeet.'
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Default 07-27-2007, 14:48

It was there because I read it. The whole board seems to have looped back in time - it gives me several what it calls new posts but I've already read them.
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Default 07-27-2007, 18:52

OK, second attempt...

WELL. That was awesome. Ignoring the cheesilogue, of course. I cringed at Scorpius. I wanted to call my kid that.

I thought it was exciting and tense from the start. After the obligatory evil-elsewhere chapter, the Privet Drive stuff did a good job of setting the tension that lasted more or less through the whole book. Then once they'd shuffled out, it was straight to the action. The multiple Potters were good, and I liked how the subsequent attack felt unexpected, even though all the characters had been mentioning how dangerous it would be.

After the Burrow/wedding scenes, the Grimmauld Place and tenty stuff was all interesting enough, and the series of action-packed excursions was great. It didn't seem to stop: the Ministry, the Lovegood residence (that horn thing made an excellent exploding barrel), Godric's Hollow, Gringotts, and then the Big Hogwarts Blowout (of which more later).

This was all balanced out by the various twists, turns, backstories and revelations, something that had been lacking in the last one, and it didn't stop until the very end. There was all the Hallows stuff, and although I was sort of expecting Snape's revelation, Dumbledore's backstory was especially interesting. It was pretty cool how it incorporated previously obscure characters like Bathilda Bagshot, Grindelwald and the Grey Lady too.

The Hogwarts battle at the end was gratuitous. Having what seemed like all the surviving characters ever mentioned return to fight was both awesome and ridiculous. I remember finding something really stupid...Percy saying to Fleur something like, 'So you're my sister-in-law now?' Hello good writing.

Forget the Dumbledore revelations: my brain broke when Mrs Weasley said 'bitch'.

For all the size of the death count, I thought it was mostly well handled until that final battle. Fred's death was shocking and dramatic, but then Tonks and Lupin just felt like they were thrown in as an afterthought to make sure we felt it, and Colin Creevey just felt tacked on.

Poor Dobby.

Poor Hedwig.

Overall, though, although the action was a bit exhausting at times, I thought it was a good book and an excellent end to the series.


And I said to myself, 'I am glad that I am not a clockfeet.'

Last edited by chrisjordan; 07-27-2007 at 18:58. Reason: to add bits
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Default 07-27-2007, 19:20

I enjoyed it. I didn't want it to end! A lot of things stick in my mind about it.

I wasn't entirely sure about the epilogue. Who was the new headmaster? Was Victoire supposed to be Bill and Fleur's daughter? I also wondered about George, and whether he was rich and famous without Fred. Harry and Ginny, Ron and Hermione... it's what everybody expected, I suppose. What happened to the Death Eaters? I know it would have been a bit of a leap to have them still talking about it 19 years later, but now my curiousity will never be sated! And the Dementors? How did the Ministry ever control the Dementors anyway?

After learning what deus ex machina means, I think it applies to a couple of bits in the book. Ron speaking Parseltongue, indeed. Possibly the worst bit in the book, I'd say. I snapped right out of it at that point. Surely you can't speak Parseltongue by hissing something you heard someone else hiss once.

Fiendfyre as well! If it's one of the things powerful enough to destroy a Horcrux, how did Crabbe (was it Crabbe?) learn to conjour it? Handily, it destroyed the horcrux. The horcrux that Harry found by remembering a dusty old tiara he luckily stumbled across the year before, in a cathedral sized room nobody else knew was there.

I didn't know whether to think Snape was good or bad until he died, and leaked his thoughts, when I knew he was good. The scenes in the Penseive were certainly impressive, but it still nags at me a little that Voldemort was supposed to have been "the most accomplished Legilmens the world has ever seen". Perhaps Snape was an even better Occlumens.

The Imperius curses didn't bother me. Of the three Unforgivable curses, the Imperius curse seems like the light option. Using it to stop two Death Eaters torturing children and summoning Voldemort to come and kill Harry seems like a reasonable breach.

The bit when Harry spoke to Dumbledore in Kings Cross was surreal and slightly disturbing to me. The flayed baby... what did it represent? the part of Harry's soul he had lost to Voldemort? The part of Voldemort's soul left in him? Was it a part of Voldemort that had died and gone with Harry to the ethereal Kings Cross? Was it perhaps meant to reveal compassion in Harry?

I loved the bit with Aberforth. Throughout the whole series, Dumbledore has been portrayed as a near infallible, brilliant wizard without a blemish on his record. To get such background was captivating. But did anyone else want Rita Skeeter to get gruesomely yet amusingly murdered?

Mostly, I loved it. I was glad they didn't just leap into action with a foolproof plan, or work out where all the horcruxes were as if by magic (although, as I said up there, the diadem was a bit of a stretch). I want to read it again, catch the bits I might have missed and think about it a bit more with everything everyone has said in mind. But that will have to wait until I need to get the train to Scotland again.

I saw the film (Order of the Phoenix) last saturday as well. Certainly the best film yet. Imelda Staunton couldn't have been any more perfect as Umbridge. She actually seemed MORE EVIL than she did in the book. Difficult in a pink tweed two piece. More Snape would have been good. I look forward to the next film... when Harry is supposed to be 16. Ha! Daniel Radcliffe is Harry, but he doesn't really look like a teenager anymore.


That would also be... CONDENSATION.
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Default 07-27-2007, 19:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by Delphine View Post
Surely you can't speak Parseltongue by hissing something you heard someone else hiss once.
Well I've done it.

Edit: Also, some comeuppance for both Rita and Umbridge would have been good.


And I said to myself, 'I am glad that I am not a clockfeet.'

Last edited by chrisjordan; 07-27-2007 at 20:01.
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Default 07-27-2007, 21:39

Haha! look what I've found:

Exclusive: Finished ‘Potter’? Rowling tells what happens next - Wild about Harry - MSNBC.com

LIttle more info about what happened post-hallows
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Default 07-27-2007, 21:54

So it was Mr Weasley who got the reprieve - but still not sure who was bumped off as a last minute decision.
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Default 07-28-2007, 21:57

Quote:
The bit when Harry spoke to Dumbledore in Kings Cross was surreal and slightly disturbing to me. The flayed baby... what did it represent? the part of Harry's soul he had lost to Voldemort? The part of Voldemort's soul left in him? Was it a part of Voldemort that had died and gone with Harry to the ethereal Kings Cross? Was it perhaps meant to reveal compassion in Harry?
My interpretation was indeed that it was the bit of Voldemort's soul that had been split from Harry just seconds ago, an incomplete and rather random bit, unlike the other pieces hidden in the Horkruxes that were more closely examined: The diary held the adolescent Tom Riddle, the locket held his eyes, and was maliciously observing... Well, I am not sure about the last part, but I definitely agree that it is part of Voldemort's soul.
I also remember Harry saying, in the duel scene later, to Voldemort something along the lines of "I have seen what you will become, if you don't show remorse..."
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